Am I Unique?

[PaulNZ]

Or am I a collective, made up of my experiences and interactions with thousands of people over my lifetime who have directly or subliminally influenced me, forming my world view?

Am I an individual entity and unique as a person as is the generally accepted theory, or am I nothing more than a collection of other peoples influence? Are we a collective consciousness as a human specie without even knowing it, each passing on influence with every interaction in a seemingly never ending cycle?

;-)

Thoughts anyone?

:9898:

[nicole]

Or am I a collective, made up of my experiences and interactions with thousands of people over my lifetime who have directly or subliminally influenced me, forming my world view?

Am I an individual entity and unique as a person as is the generally accepted theory, or am I nothing more than a collection of other peoples influence? Are we a collective consciousness as a human specie without even knowing it, each passing on influence with every interaction in a seemingly never ending cycle?

;-)

Thoughts anyone?

:9898:

yeah..i think we are unique..were born unique..llook at our differences in reactions to stuff....babies have different ways of responding to things all t he time..experiences we have in our lives arent really the parts of us that make us unique..its how we responded to them that makes us unique....see?...lets say..like wit h this big tsunami..some people paniced when they saw it coming in.. and flipped out...others just probably knew it was the end..and they were calm..some looked at the sky for the last time..some looked at their kids for the last time...some clawed at rooftops tryin to hang on ...the will to live...

were all differnt...the genes is wut what makes us unique..my opinion

[PaulNZ]

yeah..i think we are unique..were born unique..llook at our differences in reactions to stuff....babies have different ways of responding to things all t he time..experiences we have in our lives arent really the parts of us that make us unique..its how we responded to them that makes us unique....see?

We are born a blank slate with regard to consciousness, knowledge and experience. From that point on don't we accumulate experiences through existing and interacting with those around us?

As we mature and start to think more about life, things take on more meaning for us and as a result have influence on us. I read a book about the wonders of nature and suddenly that author might have had a profound effect on my thinking for example. The author, without even meeting me, has had influence and changed me haven't they?

If I go through military training as a young man, for better or worse that will have a profound influence on me and how I view those around me. The instructors inflict pain on me to force me to appreciate the importance of team and unity. Prior to this imaginary influence, I was a different person.

If my father brutalized me as a child would that not influence the type of person I am?

Is this not a collective of influences from other people and experiences contributing if not making up my entire being? Just a thought...?

[nicole]

We are born a blank slate with regard to consciousness, knowledge and experience. From that point on don't we accumulate experiences through existing and interacting with those around us?

As we mature and start to think more about life, things take on more meaning for us and as a result have influence on us. I read a book about the wonders of nature and suddenly that author might have had a profound effect on my thinking for example. The author, without even meeting me, has had influence and changed me haven't they?

If I go through military training as a young man, for better or worse that will have a profound influence on me and how I view those around me. The instructors inflict pain on me to force me to appreciate the importance of team and unity. Prior to this imaginary influence, I was a different person.

If my father brutalized me as a child would that not influence the type of person I am?

Is this not a collective of influences from other people and experiences contributing if not making up my entire being? Just a thought...?

why do some babies cry when their born? why do some stay quiet?...why do some open their eyes right away? why do some keep em shut and whine a lil?

its genetic soup!! were made up of lots of stuff from our very first day!! its all a part of being unique i think..

[PaulNZ]

why do some babies cry when their born? why do some stay quiet?...why do some open their eyes right away? why do some keep em shut and whine a lil?

its genetic soup!! were made up of lots of stuff from our very first day!! its all a part of being unique i think..

Cool. From a biological perspective we would be pretty close to unique based on our ancestry and our DNA, agreed. I accept your point that some babies might cry and for example one twin will and one twin may not. However, as a conscious being they have only the minimum number of neurons in their baby brains to breath, cry, eat and poop so to speak.

As the process of aging starts and neurons connect, slowly they become a conscious being. That consciousness is as I've described above a process by which the individual accumulates knowledge. The knowledge is accumulated through experience and through interaction with others. Doesn't that accumulation of knowledge and experience go into making us who we are?

If we accept that it does, then surely we are accepting that the knowledge and experiences imparted by others on us by whatever means has influence on who we become, therefore other people are largely responsible for who we are?

?

;-)

[nicole]

i know wut youre sayin...like its like having windows on yer computer..but as time goes on..yer computer takes on programs that say things about who u are and what u like to do!!

like for me its music..i have lot s of music programs on my cpomputer at home..tones of favorites that are songs and stuff...

but when i first got the computer..it was jsut the computer with nothing on it but the learning part of it..

still..i think were predisposed to what were going to be like..

and then thers the question...

when do we really become us?? at what stage of life?...

[PaulNZ]

I think we are evolving in character from the day we are born until the day we die Nicole.

I have been playing devil's advocate so far for the sake of creating some discussion. I think we agree really, clearly our consciousness, our being, is subject to both nurture and nature as they say. Once the predetermined template has been created at conception, she's set in motion. From then on that template is subject to what has been mentioned previously.

I think we are unique yes. But what makes us unique is not simply our DNA, it is our life experience, which adds to our consciousness every day and doesn't stop until the day we die.

;-)

[TeleFuzz]

As you have made clear there really is no right or wrong answer. If we look at genetics in depth, then yes we are unique. Your genetic make up is different than mine. My hair sample is different, finger print, retinal, etc etc.

However at the same time human DNA is human DNA. It shares similar characteristics, that is what makes us human.

There could be no sub category under mammals called "human" if we were all totally different.

What makes us unique is how we interpret what we read, hear, see, and feel. Military training might make you bitter and angry from the harshness you experience. However it might make me happier because I have a more disciplined and structured life.

You might read a book about Communism and think "wow, what a great idea!". I might think "this is awful".

You might think John Locke is a lunatic, I may think he is a genius.

However, one could also counter this by saying how we were raised, the people we spoke with before we read these books have influenced us. So we were sort of "pre-determined" as to what side we would take.

When you really get down to it, it comes down to a metaphysical nature: the why's and reasons. What makes us this way.

And presuming you have studied metaphysics at all you know that of course: there is no definite answer.

It all boils down to: maybe...?

[nicole]

nooo thers no maybe lol...we need the answer!!!

lol just kidding..

[TeleFuzz]

In philosophy, especially things of the "metaphysical" nature there is no clear cut answer; for many reasons. Knowledge comes from YEARS of constant study. Human beings are but a spec on the universal time line.

We have not been around long enough, and probably wont be around long enough to get all the answers. Our existence is finite, like our solar systems. We will most likely die before our solar system burns out, and even if we live that long, its doubtful we may ever LEAVE our solar system. It is difficult enough to travel to our moon, or even Mars. Imagine LEAVING our solar system.

Our limitations do just that, they limit us. Science will only go so far (which is why Atheists always amuse me. Science will not give you all the answers, nothing will), and even so the Universe is always changing. It will expand until everything is too far from its home star to support life, or contract and explode.

Human beings are... different. Sometimes we hold on to ideas that are dead wrong, just because. Economic schools of thought for example. Some people believe in the classical model that says: self interest is key, the government should only provide defense, laws, and public goods (roads, bridges, libraries, etc). Those in this school of thought believe the government has no place making economic restrictions. The market corrects itself.

However, it does not always correct itself.

Likewise people who believe in government intervention believe the government needs to sometimes step in and force or encourage economic policy. A good example of this in America is subsidies, especially for farmers. In the end this hurts the American tax payer (long explanation, if you are really interested say so and I can explain more).

Both can be VERY wrong at times, and both can be VERY correct.

So again... we come back to...: maybe? Human beings are too fickle and have too short of an attention span to really say "this IS the right answer".

[PaulNZ]

Good point about humans being fickle.

Aslo that was a good point about relying on science for everything. Logic requires set boundaries to give it meaning and reference. Therefore it cannot be applied to topics relating to feelings and emotions. Given that feelings and emotions are a large part of our consciousness, this leaves rather a lot open to interpretation where science cannot really go.

So of course if it boils down to the fact that whatever subject you are defining, if it has a human element with regard to our consciousness, then it is by definition subjective and not fixed.

I do still believe that when you read a book and interpret it a particular way, that interpretation is more to do with the conditioning you have been through in your life experiences than it is to do with DNA. Your ancestry may give you slight traits, but your mind is a hologram across your whole brain that consists of your life. Maybe?

;-)

[TeleFuzz]

Good point about humans being fickle.

Aslo that was a good point about relying on science for everything. Logic requires set boundaries to give it meaning and reference. Therefore it cannot be applied to topics relating to feelings and emotions. Given that feelings and emotions are a large part of our consciousness, this leaves rather a lot open to interpretation where science cannot really go.

So of course if it boils down to the fact that whatever subject you are defining, if it has a human element with regard to our consciousness, then it is by definition subjective and not fixed.

I do still believe that when you read a book and interpret it a particular way, that interpretation is more to do with the conditioning you have been through in your life experiences than it is to do with DNA. Your ancestry may give you slight traits, but your mind is a hologram across your whole brain that consists of your life. Maybe?

;-)

Fair enough, but there is still a uniqueness in that interpretation. Yes, perhaps the way I was raised, grew up, etc, make me a better candidate to "enjoy" the military lifestyle.

But then is that not unique? Sure its influenced by other things, but I still have to make choices.

Granted, a certain amount of "uniqueness" is lost because of outside influences, but that is what makes man, man. Society.

We learn through socialization. If you take a baby lock it in a closet and just feed it... it will be an animal when it grows up. It will only know the basic instincts of survival and procreation. If it is not socialized it will never learn.

So perhaps in order to be "human" we need to surrender a bit of our "uniqueness", or perhaps we really don't have any at all.

Can anything truly be unique? What would you define as unique? Sure samples of DNA are different... and even to some extent unique to the individual... but again... we can determine if it is human DNA or some other DNA. So to some extent it is not unique.

Not presenting an argument here, as often times philosophical debate leads only to more questions and possibilities and rarely answers.

[PaulNZ]

"Not presenting an argument here, as often times philosophical debate leads only to more questions and possibilities and rarely answers."

That might be why we enjoy it TeleFuzz.

:)

[TeleFuzz]

I did not mean argument as in the childish "no ur Tttl stoopid, i pwnt u" argument.

I meant a "this is your position, this is mine. This is why I believe I am right, and these are the points I find questionable and why in your statement".

I am not countering what you say, just rambling in a sort of constructed related way.

I can enjoy philosophy sometimes, other times it turns into a debate about politics... which can be understandable, but in a greater sense of things the two must be kept separate to reach, understand, and learn new things.

[TassieChick =)]

Definitely we are, the term unique is like extraordinary....each of us were born special..

[Newagemystic]

This is a question better asked to yourself, but seeing as you did ask it, here is my answer:

You are unique, there is no other exactly like you any where. But you are the same to everyone else in that sense.

You are a collective gathering of other people's influence but only as much as you allow. People may try to influence you, both intentionally and unintentionally, but you are the one to decide if that influence will effect you.

Humans are fickle creature: our differences are what make us the same.

[Newagemystic]

"Not presenting an argument here, as often times philosophical debate leads only to more questions and possibilities and rarely answers."

That might be why we enjoy it TeleFuzz.

:)

The answers are in the questions, look and you will find them :)

Maybe not the answers you are looking for, but answers still. No one is making you accept them. As a philosopher it is my firm belief that all answers are possible, and it is up to us to consider all the possibilities, yet it is also up to us to agree or not.

"You believe what you will and I shall believe what I will, but we both believe." -Newagemystic